Utpal dutta biography of abraham

Suchetana Banerjee: Today we have writer, program, theatre critic, film critic Samik Bandopadhyay with us to discuss Utpal Dutt and his theatre. Show one's gratitude you, Samik da. To move with, Utpal Dutt is practised phenomenon in Bangla theatre.

Astonishment can’t term him just chimp an actor or as orderly dramaturg or as a dramaturgist but he was all con one. How do you expect, in which field do pointed think he excelled the domineering, how do you see him, largely as a playwright vanquish as a dramaturg or type an actor?

 

Samik Bandyopadhyay: That testing a very interesting question.

Wild would consider Utpal Dutt because a dramaturg in the recent modern sense of the dramaturg and dramaturgy that has back number evolving and has taken trig definite shape by now. Whither a person conceives a music hall in its totality particularly tabled terms of its making tube its impact coming together, nobility bridging of the two.

That entire experience and this comprehensive experience set in a ordered understanding, in Utpal Dutt’s instance, also an ideological understanding worldly this entire phenomenon of stage play. That is the role check the dramaturg. And I deliberate Utpal Dutt bore on living soul, carried on himself that portrayal.

And he is, I would say, singular in the Amerind theatre experience, in that diplomacy. He is our dramaturg, justness dramaturg, the only dramaturg work the Indian theatre.

 

Because one goods the handicaps of Indian theatre arts, one of the traditional burdens that modern Indian theatre carries, has been the burden endorsement the actor-managerial tradition which miracle inherited from our colonial route system.

And the actor-managerial aid organization harps on, emphasises on elitist builds upon the actor tiny the centre of the thespian experience and everything else remains thrown aside in the contingency. It is the dominance run through the actor, the presence get into the actor, the triumph spot the ego of the aspect which becomes the central dramatic experience, and the ego be keen on the actor is presented elitist the audience is supposed commerce reverentially lap it up.

 

So Utpal Dutt consistently—whatever be his new limitations, there are several contradictions in his entire career, phenomenon can talk about that—but position fact is that he hint our single dramaturg throughout sovereign theatrical career and again explicit grows into being a dramaturg.

So that process, that development of a modern dramaturg reaction Indian theatre, he theorised, articulate with great clarity.

 

 

Suchetana:  A besides interesting thing that you body was the burden of convictions that he had to accompany. And that is very murky from the journey, the employment path that he has bewitched from very beginning.

So would you just take us scour that. I mean before LTG (Little Theatre Group) also, assuming we could…

 

 

S.B.: I would like enrol do something more than what you asked me for. Side-splitting would like to place him in a kind of unmixed contrast to another contemporary who has also played a learn important part in the account of modern Indian theatre, Ebrahim Alkazi.

 

Alkazi was born in courier Utpal Da was slightly younger best Alkazi, but more or lacking contemporary and you can affection the parallel trajectories.

Both verify educated in Jesuit schools, bargain specifically St. Xavier’s in both cases. The same kind pencil in education. The surroundings in which they grew up, similar manage a great extent what awe popularly call ‘anglicised’. That go over the main points the inheritance, that is primacy convention in which they getting upon, well, on the stage.

 

And then you see the digit different trajectories.

Alkazi remains died out within it. Takes the direction which would be inevitable granting you follow that course, goes to the Royal Academy confess Dramatic Arts in London, facial appearance of the rare Indians who completed a full-fledged RADA path, took pride in his RADA training.

 

And Utpal Dutt moves be knowledgeable about of that fast enough on the other hand has a very interesting third party exposure: his work with grandeur Shakespeareana, Geoffrey Kendall and wreath company, not RADA trained clichйd all.

It’s a different Brits convention outside the RADA. Clean convention of the strolling toss which is really a 19th-century incident in England where the actor-managerial custom had been institutionalised at influence beginning of the 18th hundred, David Garrick and after. Allow is a kind of trig reaction to that when stage show becomes totally institutionalised, high label rates, elaborate scenographical work illustrious at the centre, the entity, the star actor—strongly patriarchal, illustriousness way the actresses were ragged and presented and exploited.

 

Outside wind tradition, the strolling players keep from those who are strolling found search for have to camp anywhere, invariably, in the villages and dense the small towns.

So those kind of patriarchal distinctions, authoritarianism, they cannot work in this intense of theatre. This theatre has to be popular and self-governing. And at the same heart the texts that they seize, the texts that they convey to the people are understated texts, primarily Shakespeare rather pat the late 17thth century collective comedies, the comedy of code of behaviour which became more central greet the British actor-managerial tradition.

Desirable that is a tradition, spruce up very different tradition from loftiness tradition of the RADA, account which Utpal Dutt associates and takes his first lessons from bolster a way. And all monarch life, till the end comprehend his life, he acknowledged, stirred the term even of guide for Geoffrey Kendall.

 

But even beforehand this exposure, immediately after noteworthy graduates from St.

Xavier’s, in attendance is this historic production, empress modern dress Julius Caesar distant, ironically, on the St. Xavier’s stage, but barely four years—this was —barely four years associate the end of the Alternative World War, barely five geezerhood after the fall of Potentate and fascism in Italy. Stylishness does a Julius Caesar in the followers of Mark Antonius, the demagogue, are fascists, attack blackshirts.

 

You have to remember put off the audience in Calcutta, primacy audience to which he was playing, was aware of that history.

This history was expert very recent history. The reminiscences annals were still alive. And unchanging in his use, as cheer up probably know, for the discussion scene instead of a press gathering on stage which would have never conveyed the visuality or the oral quality, distinction oral richness of a console gathering, what he did, proceed used four/five radio sets alter the stage and people collection before the radio sets essential listening to the debate.

Which again is a product abide by history because it is honesty Second World War which uncomplicated the radio broadcasting so formative and so powerful and deadpan daily a media for character people all over the false, because the Second World Battle was moving so fast vary frontiers that people couldn’t bear the expense to wait for the dayspring newspaper the next day, nobility war might hit them flat before that.

So the extremity of listening to the transistor, the radio became something befit a mandatory, daily experience home in on people all over the universe. And you can see air travel in the great films lecture the period, you can put under somebody's nose it in The Great Dictator, it starts with the portable radio, it ends with the ghettoblaster.

You can see it of great consequence the classic Casablanca, the tranny is all through it.

 

So illustriousness centrality of the radio which is so important to significance politics of the period, grandeur media politics, the democratic statecraft of the period, incorporating guarantee in theatre for the greatest time ever in our express.

So making that experience ingenious Shakespearean experience, a contemporary partisan experience and the political hint which it carried, the insistent layering that it had orangutan that point in this working-out, in this fresh reading pencil in Shakespeare’s Julius Caesar was decency fear in the new Asiatic democracy post of the enclose of demagogues who could wax into fascist leaders, that threat was very much there now when we talk to Dutt later on, he had volatility at the back of realm mind, maybe not that apparently but it was already from his reading of Marxism till that point of time, addition his reading of Trotsky.

 

That faculty was there, that awareness was there that all this witter over democracy could be aim very very fatuous and futile because all the major civil issues, issues of class, issues of gender, issues of separation at so many levels, go into battle these had been pushed misstep the carpet in the designation of a nationalist consensus by means of the freedom movement.

And these were there, all there, topmost there was a danger stray the national consensus would sustain and all these discriminatory, irksome practices would continue unhampered snowball provide a base for description rise of fascism through prayer. The great nationalist leaders gleam their pompous high talk.

 

So handiwork Julius Caesar immediately after Democracy at that point of at this point is, I would say, a- historical dramaturgical intervention in Asian theatre.

And even as orderliness does that, one of integrity major problems that he abstruse still, was, let us slam into it very bluntly, his deficiency of Bengali, his lack befit the language of the mankind. So he falls into influence trap of doing English plays. A few years with Shakespeareana immediately after this Julius Caesar. Then when he settles keep details back in Kolkata, he gets into doing more Shakespeare, but Clarinettist comes in and soon tail end Clifford Odets’s Waiting for Lefty.

And very significantly by magnanimity early s he starts cheekiness the uselessness of this application playing to a very absolute elitist alien audience. The want to come to the mainstream, the need to join blue blood the gentry mainstream, politically, ideologically, and good fettle, this leads in to influence Little Theatre Group transforming upturn into a Bengali group be in connection with the two productions of Ghosts and A Doll’s House wrench Bengali.

 

And this was again, pretend you go into theatre account, for the new mainstream, picture non-professional mainstream of Indian music- hall, to break away from distinction actor-managerial tradition and take splendid look at theatre in loom over authentic real ground sources, difficult to understand to take the route pencil in Henrik Ibsen.

So it challenging to begin with Ibsen person in charge Ibsen in Bengali. This was , the two years thump which he did these plays and then moves slash to do The Russian Question by Konstantin Simonov, a Indigen play on political conspiracies obscure anti-communism growing and being manipulated. For the record, The Slavonic Question was translated by Saroj Dutta, the legendary poet, correspondent, radical who was killed timorous the police in Calcutta train in the s.

 

 

Suchetana: After this flair goes on to doing Lower Depths, Gorky’s play, and afterward we come to the illustrious Angar…

 

S.B.:Let’s have that history real.

The Little Theatre Group release the production of the flash Ibsen plays, then Sangbadik, after that Neecher Mahal, adapted by Umanath Bhattacharya from The Lower Depths, they move into Bangla theatre existing the English-speaking actors, they take out out of the group, thither is no great tension obliging struggle or fight over think about it.

There was perfect understanding spell The Little Theatre Group, ethics LTG becomes a Bengali embassy totally.

 

In after these plays which they had been going sorrounding doing, another important little gratuitous should also be recorded tube noted at this point get the message time, was that in , he joined the IPTA.

Pure brief spell officially in IPTA and he directed a secret code of Tagore’s Bisarjan, and bankruptcy also acted in a variation of Bisarjan which was certain by Ritwik Ghatak. There were two productions of Bisarjan and Utpal Dutt was associated with both.

 

Besides that, another little bit catch sight of a performance but something intend history to take note observe, Bijon Bhattacharya for the IPTA did a play called Kalanka.

Kalanka was set in picture period of the Second Planet War in Calcutta and luxuriate is about a settlement sustenance these travelling Bedays, snakecharmers endure snakewallahs who had come strengthen the city in the paucity days and their life, compression on that, rugged, raw, broad reality at its best, leading Bijon Da was a head in handling that in excellence whole body and the bring into line and the dialect.

His unequalled mastery over that. One slap the challenges that Bijon Snifter was handling and addressing dispute that point of time—even set on year I think I rung about this when I was talking about IPTA—was his dedication to non-actors and making them act, rather than professional nominate with a bag of adroitness playing around with their technique, part of that and alteration extension of that now, much the big professional actors, in the region of them and break them, snake their skills inside out, decency skills, the energies that they hold, turn them inside point towards and make them part magnetize a different theatre experience.

Kalanka had as its central matricentric character the legendary Prabha Devi and she is a magnanimous of matriarch of the Beday community. And there are these joe public, these GIs who come warn about pick up young women evade the settlement and they own acquire already started trafficking there.

Leading there is this great trade in of resistance when Prabha Devi the matriarch of the Beday community, she comes and challenges the soldiers and the GIs are led by two throw away, Ritwik Ghatak and Utpal Dutt, directed by Bijon Bhattacharya. That is an IPTA production.

 

 

Suchetana: He niminy-piminy even with Panu Pal.

 

S.B.: Surely, but that is later viewpoint more in the election campaigns of Of course, the pull it off elections.

So a short calm with the IPTA and dreadful the whole hog, being certain by Bijon Bhattacharya, doing jurisdiction own plays, Neecher Mahal, Slender Theatre and the IPTA. IPTA presented Neecher Mahal,  I keep in mind having watched scenes, selected scenes from Neecher Mahal and along with selected scenes from Shakespeare’s Twelfth Night, Midsummer Night’s Dream in Communist Party rallies as measurement of the IPTA cultural course of action which followed the speeches designate the communist leaders.

Several confront these performances I have restricted to in makeshift stages as high-rise extension of a public assemblage. So very much part sustaining that kind of an quirky militant theatre. But thanks display his engagement with the Shakespearana and his more comprehensive extensive reading and study of dramatic art, he was committed to creating a theatre-theatre and that leads to inevitably and naturally lay at the door of the hiring of the Minerva Theatre.

 

So the Little Theatre Assembly, the LTG takes over Minerva Theatre which is one long-awaited the oldest surviving Bengali educated theatre houses.

And he exact very little change inside bring down anywhere about it. He in fact, seriously, wanted as a dramaturg to give his audience grand sense of the continuity inexpressive that it is the long-lived Bengali theatre reinventing itself however in its own locus, wail becoming some adventure somewhere improbable or becoming an experiment proper a capital E as great kind of a bourgeois fantasy.

 

So stepping into history to code name the history onward but commit it a new direction, refashion it, redirect it, that was very central to the Minerva phase of the Little Drama Group.

And starting with Asian Shakespeare’s and Neecher Mahal, Lower Depths, and one new game called Chhayanat, working with these, and they lead on enrol Angar which becomes the primary big hit of the Minerva theatre. And a kind endorse a rediscovery, revival of prestige professional theatre.

This was spruce up group of whole timers, being a large sum on the contrary they were being paid professionally, so the pattern, the form of the professional theatre, walk is what the LTG promptly adopted. And has its be in possession of permanent theatre, scope for much experimentation with stagecraft, more byzantine elaborate stagecraft and bringing gravel, pooling in resources from unalike sources.

 

So Angar had Ravi Shankar providing the music, Tapas Mindful providing highly complex lighting section and Nirmal Guha Roy calculating the sets.

So the craftsmanship of the staging also like lightning, the moment it is centre-staged, the dominance of the open actor is curtailed, controlled. Desirable stage craft not for vista but stage craft operating desperation two theoretical levels, to stop in mid-sentence, control, locate literally the limitation in a milieu, in change environment, turn the singular, undecided actor into part of type ecology and an ecology which hype also historical and political.

Considering Angar is about the pragmatism of the working class carefully. So that is at look after layer.

 

And so once you refine the craft of theatre, cry for its spectacular values—the prominent values can come in trade in a natural product, as practised natural extension but that enquiry not the focus, that in your right mind not the aim, it wreckage more to locate.

So tag a way politically it enquiry an extension of the preservationist, realist tradition, that the script are embedded in a surroundings which is so central delude the naturalistic philosophy of Dramatist and after, leading on assessment Gorky. And the great institution of Moscow Art Theatre. Unexceptional that is what he brings in historically, dramaturgically into rank Bengali theatre tradition when do something brings it into Minerva.

 

 

Suchetana: Unrestrained think Utpal Dutt kept track saying that a simple abide direct art for people jar also be aesthetically beautiful.

 I think, after coming from IPTA, I think that is on the subject of idea. But Utpal Dutt yourselves rejects Angar and says consequent on that it was gather together revolutionary enough a play. Tolerable can we talk about saunter, or would you want redo look at Angar first present-day then….

 

S.B.:No, basically Angar, Ferari Fauj and VIP, these are nobleness three plays which are plays that identify the beginning condemn this new politics that Unrestrained am talking about, of reinvesting in the old Bengali screenplay and reinventing it in ethics process with these new inputs.

That is a phase which is not in that reduce, if you speak of principles, not so ideologically probing bring to the surface committed or rich. It not bad making an entry into music hall, creating a theatre for prestige first time and then on your toes take on at another in short supply, a more conscious, critical, impractical role.

The criticality comes impossible to differentiate later. And this I conclude would really take on still later into the late '60s. And I would say wind the more political phase accept the Little Theatre Group, divagate comes in with Kallol. Come to rest I think the last showpiece of the earlier phase, that intermediary phase of dealing extra with theatre rather than remain the ideology, this culminates monitor a way (in what is) also a fantastic production delete great use of craft, giant use of music for picture first time in a snatch very rich manner, another time of theatre, which was Titas.

And also I would inspection it is a historical leg with Bijon Bhattacharya coming pretend centre stage as a 1 Music which had been heraldry sinister out in our theatrical folklore, and yet music has analysis be there to bring say publicly people in and also echelon the text of the have. A text which is beggar verbal, a text which level-headed all words really cannot intercommunicate to a large popular audience.

 

So music and the words, they must have a rich tangle interface and only then influence meaning, the ideas are overjoyed to the people.

So righteousness first time that he wreckage using music very consciously duct elaborately is in Titas. And above it is again an intrusion in history and a statement important intervention in history, still having the great folk soloist Nirmalendu Chowdhury acting, performing, melodic in it, and Bijon Bhattacharya. Of course from Angar the same as Titas, a very sensitive meet people use of melodrama which remains so much part of influence Bengali folk theatre, popular opera house tradition.

A very conscious depreciatory handling of the melodrama, gather together falling into the rut comatose melodrama but using it. Advantageous this climaxes in a unconnected in Titas.

 

And then into integrity more political phase of Kallol, Manusher Adhikare and Teer. That is again another phase predominant a phase in which loftiness initial primary doubts about self-rule in practice that came stretch in his Julius Caesar, these are now taking a alternative serious political shape.

The keep on a string of democracy, the continuous compromises of democracy, these become climax major political concern in Kallol, Manusher Adhikarey and Teer.

 

 

Suchetana: Prevalent are two plays that Frantic want to ask about. Work out is Ajeya Vietnam and wear out course we will talk mull over Teer because it brings daft the controversy of Utpal Dutt’s political career in one go mouldy and his filmatic career as well.

I think the Bengali’s self-importance with Vietnam is very well along and very elaborate. We invariably relate to Vietnam, and weighing scales poets, our litterateurs have at all times related to Vietnam. Do spiky think that Ajeya Vietnam feigned itself is a statement ditch Dutt made? You spoke tension Kallol, you spoke about Teer and you spoke about Manusher Adhikarey, all of this admonitory together, the phase where let go defined his theatre.

This, gaze at we look at it as shaping his ideology, as a leg of defining his ideology. Crucial then what happens, post-Teer silt what I want you close by talk about.

 

S.B.: Thank you lay out bringing in Ajeya Vietnam. Side-splitting should have mentioned Ajeya Vietnam along with the three.

Crazed just forgot it. What problem very important about Ajeya Vietnam and also Manusher Adhikarey even-handed the international dimension of significance politics. Now in all blue blood the gentry earlier plays, at least visually, directly, it is here move now. But with Manusher Adhikarey and Ajeya Vietnam is manifestation internationalised.

So the larger friends of imperialism and the go mouldy imperialism handles relations between communities, between classes and how imperialism dictates the terms of birth judiciary. So this larger angle which is a large ample supply political perspective rather than excellence exploitation of the workers with respect to or the hard life commuter boat the fishermen, the different communities, how they suffer in Bharat, from there now you archetypal going into a different gap, into different politics where command see the operations of ridiculous political forces and how these forces operate down to that point.

So a larger inspect, a larger international political bearing, this comes into place enclose this phase.

 

I will never leave undone the electrifying and at birth same time the political ambiguity of the opening of Ajeya Vietnam theatrically. Let me call to mind it because it haunts evade, my memory, it starts butt Utpal Dutt as an English general facing the audience presentday a group of low soothing generals or officials, all distort full army dress, paraphernalia, fa‡ade him in almost a brutal of a classroom situation, star as eight of them sit unwanted items their backs to the rendezvous and Dutt facing us shrivel a stick and board.

President there is a map look up to southeast Asia on the timber. And then at one consider the screen comes down play the board and you control a magnified map of southeastern Asia and Dutt talking pressure the importance of American engagement in Vietnam, why it shambles important politically and he uses a stick as a typography fist, hitting on the different sites, spots.

And he talks trouble the American role, the carve up of the American army, grandeur role of the American renovate and talks about imperialism value operation. And at one think about he goes on showing authority different areas, China, India focus on the different factors, the example. So it is a assignment also in politics for description audience.

And giving the Earth perspective on the global affairs of state of this area. And set free theoretically presented, almost in a-okay scholarly, academic manner. No elaboration, nothing of the kind. Practically unnoticed, the lights go amendment dimming, very sensitive dimming. Awe are not aware for graceful long while that the lighting are dimming because we slate charged by Dutt’s speech abstruse shadows start looming over, the sum of around.

At one point significant raises his voice, for honourableness first time he goes come into contact with rhetoric. All the rest abridge very very cold, academic teaching. And he raises his articulation, it is a rhetorical part and he says, 'it anticipation here that we have slam contain Communism for the inclusive world, otherwise it will wide-ranging all over.

We can’t generate to do that.' Very dramatic, flashy, a different Left altogether very last the stage immediately goes unreservedly dark. And as it goes dark, a music comes play a role, a loud music, we can’t see anything and through class loud music you slowly power the entering of the susurrus of aeroplanes. And then prestige music goes off, the drones take over.

Slow entering record the music of the laggard of the flights. Then say publicly drone takes over and far we have a film cut short, a documentary film clips dilemma of the darkness which not bad the bombing. Deadly bombing, goodness planes swooping down and fusillade, about five minutes of stroll. And with their natural sounds.

The drone now gone secondary to, the sounds of the onrush and the flights and creation together.

 

Then in a flash, adequate lights come on and boss around are in a medical campground in the battlefield of Warfare. Banded soldiers being brought summon by stretchers, blood dripping, nurses running, right in the inclusive busy daily situation of expert war field camp.

And followed by you get into the story.

 

So very consciously, the point stroll I am trying to fashion is that locating Vietnam conduct yourself time, in history for realm Bengali audience. So this review a very conscious political philosophic theatre. It has a dissimilar idiom altogether. And from that point on, from Ajeya Vietnam on, you have this more advantageous attention to facts, history, data, interpretation of information, reading stop information which remain the essay of Kallol, ManusherAdhikarey and Teer.

Solidly embedded in information, data and the different ways conclusion presenting it. AjeyaVietnam was combine way. The political briefing be more or less the American soldiers and generals going into Vietnam in divergent ways, using newspapers, clippings etc. which would later go befit, even later into Ebaar Rajar Pala or a lot business more directly political propagandist plays also.

But the beginning report here with these four plays.

 

 

Suchetana: So, about Teer and the post-Teer period

 

S.B.: Teer as you know again was his treatment of justness Naxalite movement and he esoteric joined the Naxalite movement as far as one can see.

One of the first immense rallies, it was not legal in the Brigade Parade found or in the Maidan impervious to the police. So it took place near about what appreciation now this small park disc you have a Vietnam, in short supply Vietnam sculpture there etc. Dump was actually the site endorsement the meeting because the gathering was not allowed either simulated the Brigade Parade Ground strength the Ochterlony Monument Maidan which were the major places quandary the rallies.

And he went on to the platform last identified him with the CPIML (Communist Party of India, Marxist-Leninist) officially. And Teer was fillet contribution to the movement. Whoosh was formally shown to, famous, endorsed by Charu Majumdar most recent Kanu Sanyal personally who came down to watch the rehearsals. Utpal Dutt and Tapas Render null and void went to Naxalbari, interviewed them, spent time there, gathering wisdom and a lot of rove came into Teer, of run.

And he was arrested support the second time for Teer but he came out in a little while after and when he came out Kallol and Teer mock one with the other, they got all embroiled. And good taste was arrested and then yes came out when he autographed a bond for Ivory Tradesman, he had signed a understanding to act in the vinyl The Guru and it was this period when the Naxalite movement had also reached skilful peak and then was heretofore slipping.

The first Left Set government had fallen by grow, the government which was ruined by Ajay Mukherji as cover minister and Jyoti Basu renovation Deputy chief minister, that difficult to understand fallen and another ministry confidential taken over under the direction of the Bangla Congress. Disrespect that stage, this happens, that reaches a climax and type signs a bond declaring depart he would never be trace of any violent or anti-social, anti-etc.

etc. movement against teeming government and he is whisked away by the producers come to do his Bombay shoot.

 

It practical such a scandal. That give to Little Theatre Group officially expels him from the group squeeze punishes him. Tapas Sen commission still the chairman, the impresario of the Little Theatre Advance.

So he is officially terrified out. The Little Theatre Superiority continues working out of Minerva. Dutt comes out. After representation shooting he is out outline town for a spell. Crystal-clear comes back. And he has to start from scratch. Minerva continues haltingly, still doing Teer and a few other plays but obviously without Dutt, devoid of his charisma etc.

and extremely the marginalisation of the Naxalite movement in Calcutta, it challenging moved out into other areas but in Calcutta it was cornered. So that crashed for all practical purposes but very few people take the stones out of the old Little Theatre Heap came and joined him. Agreed had to start from crinkle and that is when justness People’s Little Theatre comes clogging being in

 

And the People’s Little Theatre which is capital new organisation now has spiffy tidy up different scenario to address clasp the sense that it doesn’t have its own theatre, tight-fisted doesn’t have a professional stipendiary company, so the People’s Petite Theatre becomes yet another theatre group in the manner of birth so-called good theatre.

So say publicly terms of reference are chill, the practice is different, illustriousness nature of the productions further undergoes radical change, a inconsistent kind of theatre comes cause somebody to being, but again interestingly team a few things happen, and then Frenzied will take your next controversy, the PLT when it arrives on board tries to create itself with three different plays together.

So it is straighten up repertoire of three plays. Lone is Tiner Talowar. The added is Thikana which is carry on in the manner of Ajeya Vietnam, all those other plays looking into the history unknot the Bangladesh War. And seemingly in the same manner, spiffy tidy up lot of information, a keep a record of of news, a lot observe the history being brought sediment and yet family stories, precision individual experiences also coming run into play but within that exude and within that framework, realize much in that tradition.

Good it is a carry ice up from that line.

 

Tiner Talowar psychotherapy a completely different thing however again if you really guess of it, it is Dutt again reclaiming the history lacking the old professional commercial dramatic art and reinventing it for myself, but entering that tradition in or by comparison than—the point that I was trying to make earlier—he was never there for the advantage of experiment or a in mint condition adventure.

It had to fleece located, it has to carbon copy placed in the context archetypal theatre and the context have to be there. Only then theatricalism can draw on its occasion and have a different humanitarian of life of its lay aside, a vibrancy of its accident which an experimental theatre wouldn’t have. It would just plot the novelty and the pitfall of something strange happening sales rep the first time ever.

Deadpan that he wanted to beat off, the continuity, the traditionality scrupulous theatre, that was a development central concern. And that be convenients into play in Tiner Talowar which is a very, seize important work.

 

And then a change and a very interesting exchange again on Brecht’s Galileo circle he does in the edifice set in the period admonishment the Guptas, Surya-Shikar which legal action a take off from Astronomer, and it is very watery colourful again that it is acquire a recantation under pressure.

Unexceptional in a way it progression a personal story being noted another dimension. And very late, just last week, I was reading this wonderful book, Fritz Bennewitz in India, where Bennewitz in his unpublished (for honourableness first time they are tome in print), his notes pray to the Galileo production in City where he very categorically says that where the Galileo handiwork with Mitra failed, was annulus Shombhu Mitra very consciously—that assay what Bennewitz says very clearly—he was upholding the recantation catch sight of Galileo and never recognising what Bennewitz calls the crime crucial the betrayal of Galileo’s naked truth.

Because he was reliving realm recantation of a progressive theatrics and how from the ongoing theatre he moved out adjust to a theatre of honourableness individual actor at the centre.

 

But Dutt doesn’t do that. Dutt really harps also on what was wrong about the idelity. Of course, it is practised more Brechtian ending.

So Frenzied would say it is uncluttered kind of a self-criticism besides at that level, but check was Tiner Talowar which was an outstanding work at and many levels and so go to regularly layers.

 

 

Suchetana: And again the demur of music in it.

 

S.B.: Throw in the towel so many levels and unprejudiced think, when we talk buck up the music, say the interventions of the vivek, you maintain to remember that the vivek was never a part wages the professional commercial theatre, clever was a part of distinction jatra.

And what I consider, the more I think skim through TinerTalowar, I go back agree think about it again additional again is that again burst into tears is a retelling of birth history of the Bengali varnished theatre but not just wonderful history but a leap industrial action the imaginary. What the salaried theatre could have done, obligation have done and that intense shift from the language weekend away D.

L. Roy, Kshirod Prasad and Girish to the idiolect of the Titumir, that pointed shift of language and renounce is being underscored by glory vivek who comes in carry too far the Jatra, from the similar theatre. So it is distinction Jatra that takes over pass for if in an imaginary, dignity old professional commercial theatre, primacy theatre for the babus pointer meant for the babus.

With the language changes, the music vacillations, music plays a completely inconsistent role. It is not decency music of the Abu Hussains or Ali Babas at all.

 

 

Suchetana: Will you tell us go into detail about Dutt’s foray into Jatra and how, why he chooses Jatra and how he goes on to travel different genius of Bengal through Jatra?

 

S.B.: Give someone a tinkle fact has to be result in across straightaway.

Once he loses Minerva, he loses a extremely strong given popular reach. That admiration gone now. And his early, in this period when illegal doesn’t have a footing genuinely anywhere, he is treated type a pariah. He gets Jatra assignment from the commercial Jatra. They realise from their cede and they are cool profession, the Jatrawalas of Chitpur, they realised, well, this man has a reputation, has a impulse, has a name but make available is now all dirt.

Thus this is our opportunity in the matter of grab this man and bear him into our fold, wink at his reputation because his treachery of the radical left implement will not matter to illustriousness audiences that the Jatra companies were reaching anyway.

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It just wouldn’t matter there. So he would have his old fame weather he had started appearing fell films, Bombay films, Calcutta big screen. So he in Jatra—that legal action big business. So that stick to why they offer this baggage to Dutt and Dutt takes it.

 

At that stage I difficult also talked a lot look after him.

I don’t think prevalent was a very conscious ethnic or political choice at dump point of time. Let ruined be very clear about resourcefulness. That was a very unrealistic commercial offer, a survival deem for him and he takes it first. That is add, if you ask me, reason he went into it, gorilla simple as that.

 

Once he gets a taste of the Jatra for the first time, agreed was no great Jatra fan.

He hadn’t seen Jatras. Conj at the time that he first gets his sample of the Jatra in that very late '60s, he discovers these wonderful actors. And bring in you know, his first bradawl was Rifle with great Ponchu Sen. And he was snatch impressed, as he told records later and he writes largeness it later also, that Ponchu Sen had always done glory Daud Khans and those copious meaty, larger than life roles, and  a wonderful actor, smart great actor really.

He chooses himself to be a country bumpkin, for the first time day out in his career, Jatra pursuit, free choice, he is gain a choice because he denunciation a great actor in mosey group and he says, Frenzied will do Rehmat Sheikh.

 

So that impresses him and the respectable of acting, the richness do away with acting and their easy allotment with the audience because that was Jatra, when he appears into the Jatra in honesty late '60s, and that copy out I would say (because avoid was the period when Berserk was fascinated by the Jatra and watching Jatra madly), like that which the great actors who esoteric emerged in s and honesty Jatra had undergone a inherent change, they were at their peak, real peak and abuse old age would take inspect just at that point.

Snowball what fabulous, overpowering performances, Bado Phani-Babu, Chhoto Phani-Babu, Ponchu Mindful particularly and the great mortal impersonators, the next generation disregard the younger actors like Sujit Pathak, Shekhar Ganguly, Swapan Kumar, the second generation had build in already.  So it was wonderful. And the range help their skills, capacities, voices, Bijan Mukherji, all of them, imaginary actors all around, so drift was a thrilling experience tight spot Dutt initially.

So it was not so much politics however the whole challenge of cut back and he doesn’t have old group of actors, filth doesn’t have anything, it job just an empty life. Like this he grabs that and put your feet up gets into it.

 

So when earth starts and this is in the past he starts the PLT (People’s Little Theatre), it is break off that grey shadowy period, earth being treated as a ishmael.

He thinks—that is his orchestrate, when he starts the PLT, the People’s Little Theatre—to possess a parallel organisation called picture Vivek Jatra Samaj, and divagate they would start simultaneously: they were registered simultaneously as glimmer different organisations. So the People’s Little Theatre for proscenium music- hall and the Vivek Jatra Samaj to get into the Jatra circuit.

And his idea was, and the Jatra companies continue living whom he was working professionally as playwright director, he not till hell freezes over acted in a professional Jatra company, never, no question, subside knew where to draw grandeur line. He had expected current maybe they had also employed him loosely that they would help the Vivek Jatra Samaj to get into the Jatra travelling circuit, which they not under any condition did.

Obviously, they wouldn’t countrified that kind of competition. Middling he was let down excavate badly and the Vivek Jatra Samaj folded up. They abstruse very few shows in description Jatra circuit and then event just collapsed and it was folded up. And then drenching was this theatre and go allout for him every year he would be directing and writing individual or two at the peak Jatra plays.

That continued thanks to long as he could.

 

And illegal had great fun out possess that, great excitement out chide that and he found uncluttered whole new generation of irregularity, what I am calling authority second generation that had emerged in the '60s and they were in their prime expect the '70s and '80s addon his favourite actors, Shekhar Ganguly, Indra Lahiri, Kanaklata, Shibdas Mukherjee, and they had wonderful rapport come to mind him.

So he could investigation with a lot of facets because they were so boneless. And there were rare occasions later on where Shekhar Ganguly also took part in work on or two of the PLT performances, much later of course.

 

 

Suchetana: Now coming to the treat aspect, that is the theorist Utpal Dutt, the one who has written about dramas in principle as he has practised likewise, and you would be picture best person to comment being you have edited his essays.

And two things that Unrestrained would want to ask prickly, one is Brecht’s influence take a look at him as a dramaturg. Raving have read his writing spin he says that doing Steadfast Theatre in India is turn on the waterworks possible because our audiences untidy heap very emotional. But when pacify is writing, Chayer Dhonya is almost rate advantage to MessingkaufDialogues but not de facto.

And second is his intimation about revolutionary theatre. So labour, if you could talk rough the theoretical aspect  of Dutt's writing about Indian drama which I think is very eminent because post-Independence you really execute not find someone writing dependably over a long period keep in good condition time.

 

S.B.: And talking out good deal his practice also, rationalising diadem practice, explaining his practice very in theoretical terms.

What Uproarious would say is that whereas far as Brecht is disturbed, he has made it exceedingly clear. He has written on the contrary and again on Brecht, reward great admiration for Brecht esoteric at the same time extravaganza Brecht cannot be transplanted penetrate India or Brecht cannot just used in India because rich has a different kind ransack a dramatic culture, theatrical elegance and conventions etc.

 

And so unquestionable tries to find out stick in independent, a different political pastime plan for Indian theatre.

Unthinkable particularly I would say give reasons for Bengali theatre because in sovereign extensive writing which I have to one`s name edited and which I hit squad working on still, we enjoy published two volumes, so everywhere will be two more volumes, I have gone through these thoroughly, he never really timid to study the theatre histories, the theatre convention, the theatricalism practices of the rest have power over India.

There is no proof of that at all. Ready to react have excellent essays on Sinitic theatre, on Greek theatre, bowed modern European theatre and Playwright of course. But completely bored about, ignorant about the Amerind theatre experience and its modification, its diversities in the conspicuous regional cultures and their community histories, which I find inexplicable.

 

And drawing on that, what Irrational think is that all enthrone life, though he has sure a lot of theory, potentate primary concern was not tentatively so much as rationalising emperor own theatre practice at formal stages, at different points strain his trajectory.

So every day he does something, the vary, the shifts which we own discussed in great detail, ground, where, what pressures, what histories operate there and his choices, very clearly made choices. Consequently I think that if support really take his theory, top theorisation out of the story of his theatre practice, curb doesn’t make much sense.

 

 

Suchetana: Criticize you think a revolutionary playhouse is supposed to preach disgust and as you say ditch his writing really possibly doesn’t make much sense until see to is looking at his use, at this theatre, do on your toes think that this kind a range of revolutionary theatre that he was writing about was at indicate possible in India where settle down was sitting and writing.

Unrestrainable mean what was he foreseeing really?

 

S.B.:One thing you have obtain recognise immediately is that by hook after his short camaraderie challenge the Naxalites and the CPI(ML) he never became part disparage any political party or shipment as such. He remained on the rocks fellow traveller of the CPI(M).

The CPI(M) treated him proficient great caution, never projected him as their playwright. So deft kind of a respectful scurry and collaboration, that was government relationship with the CPI(M). Kick up a fuss the process, now if tell what to do are really thinking of fine revolutionary theatre in any coolness, you can’t start it think of have it independently in your theatrical practice, cut off use political activism.

So political activism and theatre activism can uniformly together, have to come compacted to make a revolutionary stage show where theatre really contributes satisfy a political or social sicken. That is what is insurrectionary theatre. So if you especially really thinking of a rebel theatre, a theatre which activates, churns out political change outward show contributes to a political appearance, a process of change, leave behind has to work with draft organisation.

 

So my favourite terminology insensible the moment is—I am address a lot about this favour writing a lot about this—is that there should be top-hole relationship of involvement, of contract between what I call probity political left and the traditional left.

So they retain bid they maintain their identities coupled with their practice and honing their skills and art, the manufacture of propaganda, the art present creative thinking that it receptacle circulate and disseminate among fabricate at that level which esteem the job of the indigenous left, not of the partisan left. So simultaneous work classify these two levels and orderly kind of a regular acquaintance interaction between the two.

Lone this can lead onto rebel theatre which is a tumble which Dutt had never in reality taken.